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The Ruler of the 3rd House

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Fri Aug 27, 2010 3:26 pm

Hi

In that sense, for combustion related reasons, it is better for the 5th of Sun to represent creativity rather than the Sun itself which may burn up all creative ideas.
Similarly for other specialised significations by the Sun like reading and the eyes (2nd to it), distribution, compassion and the heart (4th to it) etc.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:29 am

Hi

We already know under what circumstances planets under this scheme get karako bhavo nasto (planets conjuncting AL, Sun, Lagna or planets ruling their own specialised signification houses with the former sometimes making the effects almost doubly powerful). Under each condition, we can further classify the gradations of the karako bhavo nasto effects as follows :

(1) Planets in own, exalted or friendly signs would have the effects increased ie. gaining further ascendancy in strength.

(2) The planet involved in the karako bhavo nasto. In order of increasing strenth that would be :

Jupiter (ether) > Saturn (air) > Mars (fire) > Venus (water) > Mercury (earth) > Moon (water) > Sun (water) which is the strongest of them all and was singled out for mentioning.

The Moon, actually being the backup significator for the 1st house (Sun is the main significator of the 1st house) the intensity of the effects is also quite great.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The next principle I am going to talk about is how to use the system in an advanced way. An example would clarify what I mean.

This is something which I read :

5) Chp 3 Prakirna Tatva, Saptama Viveka, Verse 44

If Moon is in the 9th house, the union will be with a woman far advanced in age. So under this system we are talking about 9th to the Moon.

The article is from Guru Shri Daya Shanker.

So from the 9th to the Moon we can read that a man would be in a union far avanced his age. Now we know from previous posts that 7th to Moon denotes emotional union with no physical liaison and 9th is the 3rd to the 7th. So it is an extended emotional union on all fronts. We also know that 8th to Moon denotes emotional AND physical attraction by the man to the woman. And 9th being the 2nd to the 8th, it details how this attraction is manifested.

Combining 7th to Moon and 8th to Moon we then get 9th to Moon - the result shown. Guru Shri Daya Shanker himself could not see the logic behing this sloaka by the way.

9th house also signifies something that has to do with middle age including the timing of the fructification of results. It is also an Apoklima house which connotes results giving that is late in life again signifying 'advanced' in age.

So in this way you can do advanced prognostications ie. combining Bhava Bhatnam with taking planets as Ascendants as well as other basic astrological principles.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Mon Aug 30, 2010 12:49 am

Hi

I want to emphasise one more point.

With the graha as bhava principle from BPHS (stated above), it means that one acutally need not consider rulership for delineation using planets as Ascendants. But if you do, it is also OK because BPHS accepts using rulership of planets for houses with respect to Lagna. Since we are not using Planets as Ascendants solely in exclusion of the normal astrological technqiues, we can mix and match.

An example would make it clear.

My birth details are
22nd June 1962
8:32 am
Singapore 7 hours 30 minutes GMT (that is in 1962, now it is 8 hours GMT)
1 degree 16 minutes North
103 degress 51 minutes East

My 4th house is Libra and is placed 4th to Venus, 10th to Saturn, 9th to Jupiter and 6th to Mercury.

My Venus is in the 1st, Saturn is in the 7th, Jupiter is in the 8th and Mercury is in the 11th.

4th house deals with traditional knowledge and I get fortune out of it (9th to Jupiter), knows the techniques of using it to gain practical advancement (6th to Mercury), can be one of my career alternatives (10th to Saturn) and I am adaptable in using it - not so much hard and fast rules (4th to Venus). But since it has Libra on the cusp the interpretation from Venus point of view has a more significance weightage.

Nevertheless we can also branch up the chain from Mercury, Jupiter or Saturn - three alternative pathways (not necessarily based on sign rulerships which have two ways as mentioned previously). Thus branching on Jupiter's end, since Jupiter rules the 2nd and 11th to it in the chart (and these can again be further interpreted based on its positions with other planets), I can say that learning traditional knowledge is fortunate for me. In fact it brings me wealth and gains.

Similarly if I branch the chain from Saturn end, I would say that, educating people (4th is the house of education) on traditinal knowledge can be my career and it would be a healthy career choice and it will be like my second instincts so I will be able to do it well (Moon ruling infant is together with my Saturn).

If I branch the chain from Mercury, I can say that using the know the traditional knowledge for advancement in thsi practical world is my forte and this is helped not in the least by the fact that I am able to sniff out new sources of such knowledge (Mercury rules 2nd to itslef) and I am intelligent and logical in handle these new sources of knowledge (Mercury rules 5th to itself which is also 6th to Mars). It gives me great happines (Mercury is 4th to Jupiter).

So EVEN AN EMPTY HOUSE, one can branch multiple ways to give endless possibilities in chart interpretation. Which has a stornger effect would depend on YOUR EXPERIENCE IN USING THIS TECHNIQUE.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sat Sep 04, 2010 1:47 pm

Hi

To give another example of using rulerships or not using rulerships simultaneously of using this system of prediction ie. taking the various planets as Ascendants :

Suppose you have Sun, Mars and Venus on the Ascendant in Aires.

Firstly what you can say is that the general Karakatwa for Sun, Mars and Venus would be very strong by virtue of being conjunction with Ascendant and with Sun.

Secondly you say that the romantic and intense desires of the person is very strong because 5th of Mars is the 5th house to Lagna and 5th of Venus is the 5th house of Lagna. You can also say the creativity of the person is very strong because 5th of Sun is the 5th house of Lagna. And all these planets are conjuncting one another on the Ascendant. The creativity aspect would be somewhat stronger as the rulership of the 5th house which has Leo on it is the Sun.

Because of Sun's rulership, this means that Sun by itself ALSO stands for the intense desires and the romantic inclindation of the person. In fact being the ruler of the 5th house, it has more to say on this than either Mars or Venus. Also by conjuncting with Mars and Venus in the ascendant, you can say the person is VERY romantic and VERY HIGH in sexual desires. 5th of Mars also rules sports and 1st of Sun also rules the body. It thus also shows the person builds up his body through sports so as as to satisfy his romantic inclinations and sexual desires.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sat Sep 04, 2010 3:41 pm

Hi

Made some changes to the last two paragraphs to incorporate some minor details for emphasis.

This would be my last post on this. Do PRINT IT OUT and go through it. This system of prediction would definitely give you more insight to the chart.

Thanks.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:59 am

Hi

One last point.

Now in the above example, Sun rules the body, romantic inclination, intense desires and creativity.

But the rulership effects for body and creativity would be greater because these come under the natural domain of the Sun. The other two the Sun only happened to take ownership via being the ruler of the 5th house from Mars and Venus only.

Thus as you can see, although for 5th house affairs even though Sun has the final say by virute of being a ruler,

(1) Mars and Venus for 5th house still give their effects although lesser in intensity because they are not the rulers.

(2) And for Sun for the things it rules, those effects that fall under its natural domain would be stronger ie. body and creativity in this example.

Phew....

I hope I have covered all possible angles using this system and this indeed would be the last post.

Regards

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:42 pm

Hi

In the above example for the two effects which are the strongest which is the body and creativity, then we have to check whether there is karkao bhavo nasto effects.

Is the Sun on the Ascendant?

Is the Sun on the AL?

Sun is the planet most likely to give this effect being a malefic and the main significator of the 1st.

Is the Sun in Leo or Aires?

Is the Sun conjuncting malefics or benefics - though this point is minimal as Sun gives combustion effects to the planet instead. If it had been another planet rather than the Sun, then this point is worth looking. Normally benefics around the karako bhavo nasto planet concerned help sustain the attributions shown for that planet although not the living beings signified by that planet. Karako Bhavo Nasto still kills the living beings. Malefics will help neither.

If the Sun is debilited or placed in a house which it is not strong like Venusian houses, karako bhavo effects are not there. But then you have the problem of the karraka being weak and not giving the results also. The best is for Sun to be in signs and houses where it has moderate strength.

If a lot of the above points concur, then it may turn out that in this example, the Sun ruling the areas which it take over from Mars and Venus ie. intense desires and romantic inclinations may turn out to be stronger.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Tue Sep 07, 2010 12:11 pm

Hi

This point is VERY IMPORTANT so I cannot leave it out.

Once you have delineated a special signification like 5th to Jupiter is children or 4th to Moon is the mind, then further delineations can be made by taking anti-clockwise starting from the house in question.

Thus 6th to Jupiter which is 2nd to the 5th of Jupiter would rule children's money, 7th to Jupiter which 3rd to 5th of Jupiter would rule children's courage and initiative, 8th to Jupiter which is 4th to 5th of Jupiter would rule children's place of residence etc.

Similarly 6th to Moon which is 2nd to the 4th of Moon would rule your mind's resources, 7th to Moon which is 3rd to the 4th of Moon would rule your mind's initiative to plan for future action, 8th to Moon which 4th to the 4th of Moon would rule the stability of your mind (thus whether you are fickle minded or not is ruled by the 8th to the Moon although changing of the mind is ruled by the 3rd to the Moon being the 12th to the 4th of the Moon) etc.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Ann » Thu Sep 09, 2010 3:34 am

Hi Khoo

I have just started sub dasha and sub sub dasha of 3rd house the Moon (in birth chart it is in 10th in Aquarius) Dasha is Mercury/Moon/Moon - can you interpret what this will mean for me
thanks as always,

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby amitns » Thu Sep 09, 2010 4:33 am

Hi Hock leong

The reading on the topic is indeed overwhelming ! Somewhere along you mentioned about the combustion of jupiter. I have four planets combust in 9th house in libra (sun + mars +venus + mercury(r) + uranus, all within 5-6 deg of the sun.

What might the effects of this? Add to it neech sun (although offset by neecha bhanga). my exp is that it gives setbacks in career and educations, among others.

dob - 24 oct 74; 15:12 hrs; thane (nr mumbai) India

Thanks

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby nina » Thu Sep 09, 2010 6:07 am

Hi Amit

Sorry to intrude.. you have Sringataka Yoga, which I don't see very often. Sringataka meaning a mountain with three peaks means the native with this yoga is born with self-reliance, strength or haughtiness. Mountains representing challenges as well as competition, the native is therefore always ready to accept challenges. It is the emphasis on houses 1,5 & 9 which makes the native self-reliant, all three being houses of self, but along with it comes the desire that others become self-reliant as well. So this yoga is not so good for harmonious relationships since relationships have some basis on mutual dependency which is the opposite of this yoga.
Do you feel you can relate?
Thanks.
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby amitns » Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:37 pm

Hi Nina

Thanks for your post, it gives me a lot of hope! Yes in a way i am never able to listen to or take instructions from anybody, whether in home or office. I usually do what i like to do. That probably does not add to my social company. Also I rarely go to social functions or parties with friends, but I though that was to do with moon in 12th. Your post add another aspect to it, if I understand u correctly.

Hence I feel I not doing well in the job to the extent i should, hence should start off on my own, instead of doing a job.

I noticed that my wife too has a similar yoga (dob XXXXXX: 22:10 hrs, Pune, India), all planets (other than mars and saturn and rahu/ketu) are in 5th /9th

What abt the combustion part, any hints on that ?

regards

Amit
Last edited by amitns on Sat Sep 18, 2010 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby nina » Thu Sep 09, 2010 11:56 pm

Hi Amit,

Thank you for your comments. What you're saying really fits my understanding. Actually you have a near perfect Sringataka Yoga. (I only have to move one planet to obtain this yoga). But your wife doesn't. (I'd have to move 2 planets then). She's more like a Sara yoga. (I only have to move one planet then) - note it's hard to get perfect Akriti Yogas. Sara means arrow. This yoga is more about emotional neediness & its difficulties. Do you think that fits her? Apart from that she does have a packed 5H. Does she work in education by any chance?
Combustion doesn't help worldly matters. It does help inwardly though - so a combust Mars can give you the Martian attributes psychologically, at best, but the outer realization of the planet as house lord is hurt. So it hinders what it represents. You have to check the Sun also, as karaka. Note that 10L in 9H is great. Ra/Ke on 10/4 would create ups & downs with work anyhow.
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby amitns » Sat Sep 11, 2010 3:14 pm

Hi Nina

She was working in electrical design before we came abroad, but was not happy with it. She rejected a teaching offer earlier, but now she feels she should give it a try. Probably thats a better career for her. Regarding the emotional neediness I am not sure. Probably you can elaborate

Thanks

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby rajitha » Fri Sep 17, 2010 9:39 am

Khoo,
You impressed me totally. I did not know that you could read Sanskrit. How did u get into learning Sanskrit?

BTW, I was away for a month or so. I missed the forum and all the posts and slowly catching up.
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sat Sep 25, 2010 7:55 pm

Hi Learned Members

For the system that I expounded, one can include the Arudha Pada of the Houses as well.

Take it that the house where the Arudha Pada of another house is situated and predict the COMPOUND effects accordingly based on the relative position of the houses with respect to the planets.

For example :

My 7th house to Venus denotes the mate which falls in my 7th house to the Ascendant. It has A9, A10, A3 and A4. Now just take one of them, say A9.

A9 means the the mate house (7th to Venus) has connotative effects of my 9th house to the Ascendant. My 9th house to the Ascendant is 2nd to Jupiter, has A5 on it, is 10th to the Sun, 9th to Venus, 9th to Rahu etc.

So my mate could be a foreigner (9th to Rahu), good planner (9th house has A5 and my A9 is on my mate house ie. 7th to Venus), has certain rank and status, gives me steady affections (9th to Venus) etc.

So considering Arudha Padas can add considerably to our analysis.

Best Regards

Hock Leong

Hi Rajitha,

You are back. Have no time to read the posts including your post. Will do so at a later time.

Came back just to post this so as to make the system more complete

Regards
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Ann » Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:54 am

Hi Khoo

Can you shed any light on my question about the sub-dasha of the 3rd house - please.

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sun Sep 26, 2010 3:32 pm

Hi Learned Members

Most astrologers tend to forget that when the dasa of a house A is operating, then the 9th to it ie. house B also adds to its effects SECONDARILY.

Same with this system of taking planets as Ascendants. Now we know each year, each house takes over the role of its effects. So we have 1st year is the 1st house (from the time of birth to your 1st birthday), 2nd year is the 2nd house (from the 1st birthday to the 2nd birthday), 3rd year is the 3rd house etc.

Now we know when a particular house is being emphasised, all its effects including its relative positions from other planets will be felt. So for example, this year after my 48th birthday (give or take a few months for the same Tithi percentage as in date of birth) which is the 49th year, my 1st house takes over. Now my 1st house is 3rd of Mercury (deals with writing), 4th of Mars (my integrity is shown), 2nd of Sun (do a lot of Vedic reading) etc. All these effects would be shown.

But so does the 9th to the active house for that year, which in this case happens to be 9th house to the Ascendant. Thus secondarily, my writing and reading knowledge is shown through this forum. Now my 9th house to the Ascendant is 10th to the Sun (which deals with rank, status and fame), 11th to Mercury (I communicate via groups and the writing part is emphasised because my 1st house is 3rd to Mercury) and is 2nd to Jupiter (ruling wealth - it could be spiritual wealth because since it is the 9th house that is involved - I was asked by Saptarishis Magazine to be one of the editors and research officers on testing various new Vedic techniques - I said I would think about it).

So whatevr dasa you are using, note that the house that is active, look to its 9th house from it. That house would also have spillover secondary effects.

Warmest Regards
Hock Leong

Hi Ann

I will look into your query.

Regards
Khoo
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:44 pm

Hi Learned Members

Remember in the example of my own chart regarding the 9th house (to the house where in that particular year the dasa of that house is operating) effects, since Jupiter rule my that 9th house, it also rules the 6th house. Hence for this year 2010-2011, the 6th house effects would also be felt by virtue of rulership.

I would be offered jobs out of nowhere.

Jupiter is also placed 8th in my chart so 8th house effects would be felt. Moon rules my 1st house (the house which the current dasa is operating) placed in the 7th house, so this year 7th house effects are also felt.

So rulership effects must be considered as well. Hence for this year, 1st, 9th, 8th, 7th and 6th house effects would be felt.

Warmest Regards
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby astro123 » Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:31 pm

inery interesting....u said u have jupiter running what abt the double tranist with saturn...jupiter is transiting pisces this year and u said ur in asc sign of cancer ..in u r case there is a double transit happening in ur 5th house ...so 5th house matters shud also come to the fore..now the other general question that i had is whenever a dasa of a planet placed on 8th house runs do we take the nakshatra ruler of that planet aslo to account..what if NL is placed good/strong and func benefic

ur jupiter is placed in 8th house so it is making its trinal aspects other thena the 7th aspect of course..will this aspect be considred bemefic or malefic coz they are being made by jupiter placed in a dusthana??
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby Khoo Hock Leong » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:01 am

Astro123, I will reply to your query later.

Hi Learned Members

Now refer to my recent post about which houses destroys the significations of a particular house ie. the 2nd, 12th, 8th, 7th, 6th and the 10th to it. On the other hand, the 5th, 9th, 4th, 3rd, 11th and to a certain extent the 2nd would help to sustain the significations of that house.

So using this system of taking planets as the Ascendant, we can make use of the above principle to get further delineation of the results of a person.

To take an example, my 10th to Saturn ruling my profession is the 4th house to Lagna where Libra falls on it so the ruler is Venus. Of course this 4th house to Lagna is also 9th to Jupiter, 5th to Sun, 4th to Rahu etc. so I have fortune in my career, creativity in the career, vicissitudes in my career etc respectively. - that we are all familiar by now.

But this 4th house to Lagna has the supporiing water houses 8th to Lagna with Jupiter in it ruling the 9th and 6th to Lagna as well as 5th to Lagna with Sun in it ruling the 2nd to Lagna. It also has the support of the house 7th to Lagna with the Moon in it ruling the Lagna. Saturn is also here ruling this house itself (it does not rule the 8th because it is in its own sign in the 7th house). The trine houses to a house and the 4th to the house are one of the main set of supporters to a house besides the 3rd, and 11th to the house. So I can say my career (10th to Saturn which is the 4th house to Lagna) is best in the field of education (4th to Lagna) and it is best worked under the auspices of the government (the Sun in the 12th) under the Ministry of Education (Jupiter in the 8th which also deals with field of research in education) and employed as a public servant (Moon in the 7th).

Sun in the 12th is 5th to Jupiter, so my education job involves teaching of young kids, Jupiter is 9th to the Sun so the research if I undertake in education can be funded by the government, and the Moon being 7th to Venus can mean I am a supporting teacher employed to assist the main teacher in the teaching workload.

You see how complicated the analysis can get!!

Thus this system of taking planets as ascendants, we can also use the relative positions between house thrown in to add to further insight.

Warmest Regards
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby astro123 » Sat Oct 09, 2010 5:30 pm

Hi khoo

i am reposting my question just in case u missed it


"very interesting....u said u have jupiter running what abt the double tranist with saturn...jupiter is transiting pisces this year and u said ur in asc sign of cancer ..in u r case there is a double transit happening in ur 5th house ...so 5th house matters shud also come to the fore..now the other general question that i had is whenever a dasa of a planet placed on 8th house runs do we take the nakshatra ruler of that planet aslo to account..what if NL is placed good/strong and func benefic

ur jupiter is placed in 8th house so it is making its trinal aspects other thena the 7th aspect of course..will this aspect be considred bemefic or malefic coz they are being made by jupiter placed in a dusthana??"


thanks
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby vhb » Mon Nov 01, 2010 4:38 am

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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby viswada » Tue Nov 02, 2010 8:33 am

DEAR ALL PARTICIPATING MEMBERS HERE
what happens if 3rd house occupied by SATURN+KETU? for ARIES LAGNA?
thanking you
best regards///
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Re: The Ruler of the 3rd House

Postby vhb » Sat Nov 06, 2010 3:38 am

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