Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

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odin100thor
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Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by odin100thor » Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:55 pm

Of all the Lagnas, I really find difficult understanding the aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna. In my experience, two astrologers have given me two contradicting replies to the same questions. And the questions I asked them were (all these questions are for Libra Lagna):
1. Jupiter is a natural benefic, but a functional malefic for Libra Lagna. So will the aspects of Jupiter considered positive or negative? This is a general question.
2. If Jupiter is aspecting 2nd house, 5th house, 9th house, 11th house, then it is aspecting its Karaka houses, then is that considered beneficial or not?
3. What is the best position for Jupiter in Libra Lagna. Is that in 6th house which creates Vipareeta Rajayoga or any other dusthana like 8th or 12th? Or is it in Lagna since Jupiter gets directional strength and aspects 5th and 9th (a Dharmic planet aspecting its Karak houses 5th and 9th) or 10th house where it gets exalted?
4. When Jupiter is exalted in 10th house and closely conjunct Lagna Lord Venus, then is that very positive as Lagna Lord is with exalted best natural benefic or very negative and results in affliction of Lagna Lord since he is with most malefic planet for this Lagna?
5. I read in books like "Fascinating Jupiter"by LR Chaudhury that according to Phaldeepika Jupiter exalted in 10th house is good because lord of two upachaya house as gone into another upachaya house and hence his aspect on 2nd house will result in a lot of money. But in reality, is this coming true? What are your experiences. Please share and enlighten me.
6. There is a shloka which says that Jupiter does not do good for the house where he stays but his aspects are always very benefic. Where as Saturn aspects are always malefic and he does good to the house where he stays. Now based on your experience for Libra Lagna is that true?
7. If Jupiter aspects 7th house is that good or bad and if Saturn aspects 7th house, is that good or bad? Or is it that both the aspects of Jupiter as well as Saturn on 7th House for Libra Lagna is Bad?

Now take all the 7 questions above and replace Jupiter with Saturn and answer all the questions, based on your experience. The two astrologers I mentioned above took exact opposite poles. One said positive for all Jupiter and negative for all Saturn and the other took the exact opposite stance and said positive for all Saturn and negative for all Jupiter.

Based on your experience in dealing with multiple Libra Charts, please enlighten me which one is true?

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by chavitarun » Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:53 am

good questions to understand astrologer by everyone.
to add :
1.For librans , if jupiter debiliated , then its aspect good or bad ( on good house and bad house separately) ?
2. what about debiliated but yogkarak aspect of saturn (( on good house and bad house separately) ?

learned members can enlighten us, please.

regards

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by Krishna » Thu Sep 24, 2015 11:12 pm

1.For librans , if jupiter debiliated , then its aspect good or bad ( on good house and bad house separately) ?
2. what about debiliated but yogkarak aspect of saturn (( on good house and bad house separately) ?
Please go through the foll. article by Mr. VaughnPaul Manley ..http://lightonvedicastrology.com/vedic- ... ic-planets

In that article he says,
However, in Jyotish the planets natural status, as either a benefic or malefic, predominate over its temporal status.
Generally, aspects by malefics (Saturn, Mars, Rahu, Ketu, and secondarily the Sun) indicate challenges and aspects by benefics (Jupiter, Venus, Mercury, Moon) indicate benefits, as well as the softenening of other malefic influences. This is true in natal chart interpretation as well as in the interpretation of transits.
Accordingly,
1) Jupiter's aspect is benefic. Aspect on a good house makes it better and the bad house that is aspected becomes less bad. However a debilitated Jupiter, may not be able to do any good
2) Saturn's aspect is bad. Its aspect on a good house makes it less good and its aspect on a bad house makes it worse.

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by yashwanth1984 » Fri Sep 25, 2015 11:13 pm

Hi, odin100thor,

My two cents regarding how Jupiter and Saturn behave in my Libra Lagna natal (D-1) chart.

Please note: I am not an astrologer, but I evince immense interest in understanding vedic astrological concepts.

In my D-1 chart (bhava chart resembles D-1 chart), Saturn is posited in the Libra Lagna and Jupiter is posited in Sagittarius in conjunction with Moon (Moola nakshatra - 2nd pada), Mercury and Venus in 3rd bhava. Having said that, I ran into severe troubles with a foreign government during Jupiter Antardasha in my previous Mahadasha of Sun (October 2008-October 2014) despite Jupiter (3rd and 6th bhavas' lord, a functional malefic but natural benefic) posited in 2nd house (Dhana bhava, Vaaksthaana) from Sun with other natural benefics.

One of the reasons why Jupiter acted as a functional malefic was because of 2-12 (Dwi-Dwadasha) bhava relationship with Mahadasha lord Sun despite being permanent friends with Sun. Since 2nd house is Vaaksthaana (House of speech), I spoke a lot against the foreign government, then. My vicious speech rattled them, and as a result I had to return to my native country. To be honest, I felt I was deported, but later realized it were my rhetorical, negative speech (and writing on social media to some extent) that ousted me from that country.

Furthermore, Jupiter, in D-1 chart, is strongly posited in 3rd bhava (House of communication) in the sign of Sagittarius (moolatrikona). Therefore, as per the dictum, "Jupiter spoils the house he is seated in," holds merit in my case. Further, Jupiter aspects 7th house, 9th house and 11th house (Badhakasthaana as well as Laabhasthaana) for Libra Lagna. There is a nexus between Sun (Badhaka, 11th lord for chara [movable] lagna) and functional malefic Jupiter (6th bhava lord) through Jupiter's 9th aspect on the 11th house (Leo). This also indicates that during Sun Mahadasha, black magic spells (voodoo) by evil people could also have haunted me, and, in turn, forced me to work against the foreign government for no good reason. Earlier Jupiter sub-periods during Ketu and Venus Mahadashas were peaceful and fruitful with no untoward incident I can recollect. Therefore, Jupiter when well-placed with regard to Mahadasha lords, along with their permanent relationships i.e., when friends with Mahadasha lords, in the D-1 chart, will not confer bad results for a Libra Lagna native provided Jupiter is strong in the horoscope.

Please note: Jupiter' yearly transit whether in good or bad houses have little or no effect on me. The results are neutral i.e., no gains or losses. But, Jupiter sub-period during Sun Mahadasha was the worst as explained above.

On the other hand, Saturn's sub-periods were beneficial during Ketu (Saturn in 12th house from Ketu in D-1) and Venus (11th house from Venus in D-1) Mahadashas despite being a natural malefic. Saturn has strengthened the houses he occupied during above-mentioned Mahadashas. Moreover, I fail to recall any unwanted and unwarranted incidents occurring during Saturn sub-periods, maybe, he was favourable in transit at the time . Overall, Saturn has been benefic in my horoscope through functional beneficence, but his 3rd aspect on 3rd bhava (communication), 7th aspect on 7th bhava (relationships) and 10th aspect (career) on 10th bhava posed major challenges relevant to those bhavas' attributes during Sun Mahadasha because Saturn is a permanent enemy to Sun and maybe Saturn was also not beneficial in transit at the time.

Now, I am in Moon Mahadasha-Mars Antardasha, and I opine my future, henceforth, shall be refulgent because for Libra Lagna Saturn is a Yogakaraka (4th and 5th bhavas' lord). Exalted Saturn aspects Moon (10th bhava lord) placed in the 3rd bhava from Lagna, so the results regarding my career shall be fruitful but delayed thanks to Saturn being a slow-moving planet. It can also be inferred that Saturn considers Moon as his enemy, so Saturn when aspects Moon form Visha Yoga. In addition, 10th bhava is 8th from 3rd bhava; therefore, I could face several upheavals in my career pursuit. That said, Saturn is currently in the 12th bhava in transit (Sade sati period), so Moon and Saturn together shall run the show for me, hoped to be yielding a basket filled with both positive (majority) and negative outcome with regard to my career, especially.

Best regards,

Yashwanth1984

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by ChandraLagna » Sun Sep 27, 2015 6:03 am

Jupiter being a "malefic" or somehow evil for Libra Lagna is a widely held belief that is somehow never explained
anywhere correctly at least that I know of. Also, tarring a planet as malefic or benefic for an ascendent is another simplification that takes away the true complexities of astrological analysis. If a human being cannot be pure white or pure black, what makes us believe the planets can be classified so simplisitically? Yes, there are planets that are by nature not "good" but even they can produce good results if favorably placed.

Before we get into answering the questions posed, one has to understand the following concept very clearly before proceeding as this is the cause of a lot of confusion.

What is that concept?

It is that the 7th house from any house is its house of marana, or death. In reality this is a more specific or narrower interpretation of "farthest". Since Ascdendent is where the native begins his life journey, it stands to reason that the 7th is his farthest, i.e. the end of the journey, his death
.

While most students already have studied this concept, application of this concept is trickier than it appears. I will write more in subsequent posts elaborating the concepts.
--यद भावं तद भवति --

With Regards,
ChandraLagna

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by ChandraLagna » Mon Sep 28, 2015 5:49 am

Coming now to Libra Ascendent, we see that Jupiter owns the 3rd house, which is 7th from 9th house of dharma. 9th stands for the divine help that aids in a man's life, whereas 3rd stands for initiative and effort and support from one's younger siblings or in general support from people younger or junior to oneself. Jupiter is the natural karaka for the 9H and Sagitarius is also the natural 9th house of the zodiac, so Jupiter represents the righteousness and the dharmic path that begets divine help. For Libran ascendents, his assigned role is that of a supportive younger sibling, or self-effort. Thus this third house assignment of Jupiter for Libran ascendents is diametrically opposite to his natural proclivity. If Jupiter is well-placed for a Libran ascendent, it makes the native assign efforts towards well meaning causes, without seeking or getting divine help, since this is the role Jupiter has been assigned for this ascendent. Lucky breaks are harder for the native when Jupiter is ill-placed since his role has gone to the opposite end of self-help. This is of course not considering the role of the 9th lord mercury.

While 3rd and 9th are 1-7 relationship, it is worth understanding that this merely points out that pure self help and absolute divine intervention are two opposite ends of the spectrum though both are needed in practice.

Dear readers, none of Jupiter's natural characteristics are lost and it is just the role that is different and this is one reason why people mention jupiter is malefic for Libran ascedents.

In next post, I will write about the 6th house, i.e. Pisces. Note that both 6th and 3rd are Upachaya houses.
--यद भावं तद भवति --

With Regards,
ChandraLagna

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by jelly29 » Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:30 pm

Jupiter is a malefic for Capricorn Lagna even.In my case its placed in 12 th its own house hence I feel the characteristics and features of that house gets amplified like I have a very nice and refreshing sleep mostly like on and off button.. Spending money comes inherently ...at the same time I feel it's influence on my Venus in 6 th has given me diseases

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by ChandraLagna » Sat Oct 17, 2015 3:30 pm

Now let's come to the 6th lordship of Jupiter for Libra ascendent.

6th as we we know is a Dus-sthana which indicates a "bad" house, but lets not forget that 6th is also trine to 10th, the zenith of a chart. 6th is thus also a Upa-chaya house, indicative of efforts and valor needed to overcome obstacles. Jupiter lording this house automatically bestows on the native these attributes, that of overcoming obstacles in life and is actually good for career. Note that this is the natural inclination of 6th house of Pisces with respect to the 10th house of cancer for a Libra Ascendent.

However, Jupiter also represents or influences of 11th house of un-earned gains.

As 6th house, Jupiter thus becomes lord of a house that is 6/8 position of gains, i.e. the 11th house of gains for a Libran. This indicates that un-earned gains do not easily come to a Libran.


Please remember that this is the natural structure of a Libran chart and does not in any way mean this is true irrespective of actual placement of Jupiter.

For Jupiter placed in 3rd house, or in 6th house though the above roles comes into play.

So, the functional role of Jupiter for a Libran diminishes the natural proclivity of two of Jupiter's natural significations - the 9th and 11th, i.e. dharma or luck and also unearned gains.

--to be continued --
--यद भावं तद भवति --

With Regards,
ChandraLagna

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by srimedico » Sun Oct 18, 2015 4:24 am

Image CL
Jai Sita Ram !

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by Khoo Hock Leong » Sun Oct 18, 2015 11:02 am

Hi

Just want to add that for a 6/8 relationship, if you are talking about compatibility between persons, direction is not important. It is generally bad. Each of the person must be compatible with the other so to speak in order to make the relationship work.

But if you talk about an individual, then the house you start with to expand to the next house ie. starting from house A then moving 6 steps forward to house B, the starting house if a good house, then the 6/8 relationship is good (even if house B is a dusthana, the dusthana effects get distilled).

So for a Virgo Ascendant, Jupiter rules 4th and 7th. 4th although is 6 houses away from the 11th, it is still good. Jupiter being the karaka of the 11th and ruling the 4th for a Virgo Ascendant, it means the person has income to buy a house (disregarding the factor of where Jupiter is placed in the chart to make things simple).

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Hock Leong

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by Khoo Hock Leong » Sun Oct 18, 2015 11:44 am

Another thing is that Jupiter for an Aires Ascendant benefits all its karaka houses. It rules the 9th and 12th houses.

(1) 9th is the 11th of the 11the and 12th is the 2nd of the 11th. Great support for the 11th, the 1st karaka house of Jupiter.

(2) Jupiter rules 9th so unless Jupiter is placed in the 9th which damage its own karaka house somewhat going by the principle that a karaka placed in its karaka house destroy some significations, otherwise it is good. But actually through experience, Jupiter in the 9th the person is highly fortunate because the 9th house stands for the 9 planets. Jupiter aspects on all other planets are considered good. So Jupiter in the 9th actually strengthens all the other planets which more than offset the principle that the karaka placed in its karaka house destroy some significations. Jupiter ruling the 9th would take precedence of Jupiter ruling the 12th because 9th is the 10th of the 12th.

So great support for the 9th, the 2nd karaka house of Jupiter.

(3) 9th is the 5th of the 5th so great support for the 5th. 5th is 6 houses away from the 12th. It is a 6/8 relationship and 12th is a dusthana. So support dwindles here. The person's knowledge in everything (5th) is somehow tempered by his lack of firm boundaries in learning. The person can be highly intelligent, but does not stick closely to conventional rules pertaining to a particular field of knowledge.

(Note that 12th still supports the 5th since it is 6 houses away form the 5th (in order to gain knowledge you have to unlearn) as I mention in a previous post; just like our 1st (the physical body) supports the 6th for doing work. Just that 12th also happens to be a dusthana).

So very good support for the 5th, the 3rd karaka house of Jupiter.

(4) Expansion of the 9th leads on to the 2nd, the 4th karaka house of Jupiter. And 9th is a very good house. So 2nd house benefits enormously. 12th is the 11th of the 2nd. It is gains to the 2nd. One of the significations of the 12th house is your parents' money.

So again very good support for the 2nd, the 4th karka house of Jupiter.

Best Regards
Hock Leong

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Re: Aspects of Jupiter and Saturn for Libra Lagna

Post by astrolight99 » Thu Oct 22, 2015 11:15 pm

Dear Khoo

In case of support to 11H by Jupiter for Aries Lagna borns, we judge it from 11H to the lordship of Jupiter 9H and 12H which becomes 11 places away and 2 places respectively. Similarly, while considering its support to 5H we judged from 5H to 9H (bhavat Bhavam) but in case of 12L instead of judging it from 5H to 12H we judged from 12H to 5H at first. Likewise, when we consider its support to 2H, we judge it from 9H to 2H (6th expansion) instead from 2H to 9H ( which is 8). Also 2H is not judged from 2H to 12H but the other way around. Why this different approach? If you do not mind, kindly explain.

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